CPPS Estimates (14 April 2025)

From Intergovernmental Affairs and Justice Committee Hansard (14 April 2025)

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Estimates for Ministry of Corrections, Policing and Public Safety

Chair B. McLeod: — Welcome back to all our committee members. And we have a new group of officials with us as well, so welcome to Intergovernmental Affairs and Justice. And we’re going to move on to the consideration of 2025-26 estimates and 2024-25 supplementary estimates no. 2 for Corrections, Policing and Public Safety and for Firearms Secretariat.

We’ll begin with vote 73, Corrections, Policing and Public Safety, subvote (CP01). Minister McLeod is here with officials. And I would ask that officials please introduce themselves before they speak for the first time, and please don’t touch the microphones. The Hansard operator will turn them on for you when you speak.

My name is Blaine McLeod. I’m the MLA for Lumsden-Morse, and I just appreciate you all being here. And Minister McLeod, please introduce your officials, and we’ll welcome your opening comments as well.

Hon. Tim McLeod: — Well thank you very much, Mr. Chair, and good evening to the rest of the committee as well. I’m pleased to introduce the Ministry of Corrections, Policing and Public Safety’s budget for the fiscal year 2025-2026, and I look forward to answering your questions.

This year’s budget focuses on how we will continue to support Saskatchewan’s Growth Plan by delivering on our commitment to enhance community safety through new and continued investments.

I’m joined tonight by deputy minister of Corrections, Policing and Public Safety, Denise Macza; and Marlo Pritchard, president of Saskatchewan Public Safety Agency; Robert Freberg, commissioner of the Saskatchewan firearms office. Also with me in the room are officials from Corrections, Policing and Public Safety and SPSA [Saskatchewan Public Safety Agency]. We have to my right, Wanda Lamberti, assistant deputy minister, strategy and corporate services. In the room, Corey Zaharuk, assistant deputy minister, policing and community safety; Josh Freistadt, assistant deputy minister, supervision and rehabilitation services; and Scott Harron, assistant deputy minister, custody services.

We have Steve Roberts, vice-president, operations; Laura Debassige, vice-president, corporate services; Michelle Broda, executive director, finance and corporate services; Noel McAvena, executive director, provincial disaster assistance program; and Chief Marshal Rob Cameron. I will ask other officials to introduce themselves if they are required at any time to answer any questions.

Mr. Chair, Corrections, Policing and Public Safety provides supervision and rehabilitation services for adult and young offenders, promotes appropriate and effective policing, and supports community and public safety services throughout the province. SPSA’s highly trained personnel protect the people, property, and resources of Saskatchewan from hundreds of wildfire events, flooding, and other types of emergencies.

This budget aligns with our government’s record investments in Saskatchewan communities, and it supports our priorities to deliver on community and public safety. In total we are investing $798 million in policing, community, and public safety services for Saskatchewan residents, which includes $118.9 million for the SPSA. Across the ministry this is an increase of $79.3 million over the 2024-2025 budget. The ’25-26 budget will invest in policing and community safety; custody, supervision and rehabilitation services; and emergency programs and services. I will now expand on each of the investment areas.

Under enhanced policing and community safety, the first area that I will touch on is policing and community safety. Government provides funding for RCMP operations, First Nations, municipal policing, and the Saskatchewan marshals service. These investments in policing enhance public safety and bolster law enforcement across the province to ensure our communities are safe and secure.

This law enforcement presence extends to Saskatchewan’s border with the United States. To enhance security and safety at the border, the government introduced the Saskatchewan border security plan in January of this year. This plan mobilizes provincial protective service officers, including Highway Patrol, conservation, and canine-handler teams, to work in partnership with provincial policing services and federal agencies to boost law enforcement’s presence at and near the border.

One of the largest areas of investment is the funding that we provide for RCMP operations through the provincial police services agreement. This year’s budget provides an increase of $7.8 million for RCMP operations, bringing the total investment to $260 million. This funding is used to deliver RCMP policing services to many Saskatchewan rural and First Nations communities.

The First Nations policing program will see an increase of $1.7 million for a total investment of $23.7 million this year. This investment includes continued support for initiatives delivered under the First Nations and Inuit policing program, including community tripartite agreements with communities policed by the RCMP, the Prince Albert Grand Council’s self-administered policing feasibility study, the Saskatchewan First Nations community safety officer pilot project, File Hills First Nations Police Service, and community consultative groups in CTA [community tripartite agreement] communities.

Funding to continue public safety commitments that were announced last fall are also included in this year’s budget. These include $6 million to hire 50 officers as part of the $11.9 million commitment to hire approximately 100 new municipal police officers; $2.7 million to hire 14 new safer communities and neighbourhoods, or SCAN, personnel to reduce crime by targeting nuisance properties and social disorder; and $1.6 million for the Saskatchewan Police College as part of the government’s $2.5 million, three-year commitment to ensure we have the necessary training to support the additional officers that are being hired across our province.

For municipal police services, $22.7 million was allocated to fund 160 municipal police positions, including 17 combined traffic-service positions and additional public safety initiatives through the municipal police grants program. Municipal police grants fund initiatives such as the crime reduction teams and the Saskatchewan trafficking response team, or STRTs.

To give some perspective on the significant impact these teams have on our crime in our province, I will share a few statistics. In 2024 and early ’25, these specialized municipal and RCMP policing teams seized more than 62 kilograms of illicit drugs, including over 12 kilograms of fentanyl. This is potentially millions of doses of this dangerous drug that did not make it into any community in our province.

Municipal trafficking response teams investigate the trafficking of drugs, weapons, and people, and they operate out of Prince Albert, Saskatoon, and Regina. Between September and December 2024, these teams opened 110 human trafficking files and initiated 67 human trafficking interventions. These are just a few of the many examples of how these strong policing partnerships help deliver on safer communities.

The Saskatchewan marshals service, or SMS, will commence operations in the coming months with the deployment of 17 fully trained officers. This is a full year ahead of schedule. $12.4 million is provided in this year’s budget to operationalize and prepare the SMS for its launch. This includes hiring approximately 50 new officers and support staff for the SMS. The SMS will focus on provincial policing priorities, including gangs, illegal weapons, and drugs, along with apprehending prolific and high-risk offenders that pose a public safety risk.

The SMS will support RCMP and municipal police operations and engage with First Nations and other communities to address high-impact, high-risk crimes. Once operational, the SMS will also provide specialized and emergency enforcement as needed.

$666,000 has been earmarked in this year’s budget to hire six weigh scale operators. These operators will enhance the frequency our weigh stations are open to conduct commercial vehicle inspections focusing on safety standards and the transportation of contraband and illicit substances. The addition of the weigh scale operators will allow Saskatchewan Highway Patrol officers to focus on patrolling highways across the province, including near the border and other public safety priorities.

This year’s budget invests $835,000 for deputy sheriffs to increase their capacity for prisoner transport. RCMP officers are currently responsible for some prisoner transport in specific locations. The initial support from deputy sheriffs will allow RCMP who have traditionally taken these duties to focus on other core policing duties.

For custody and community corrections services, the 2025-2026 budget also represents a significant investment into our provincial correctional facilities and services to support individuals in successfully reintegrating back into their communities.

Last year we expanded our partnership with the Elizabeth Fry Society from 88,000 to $165,000 annually to help women leaving custody navigate existing community supports such as housing, mental health, addictions supports, employment supports, income assistance, and family reunification. This year we are continuing that investment and adding another $280,000 annually to help the Elizabeth Fry Society provide wraparound services at a 10-unit residence they recently acquired.

These services and supports are key to the reintegration of female offenders housed through the Elizabeth Fry Society. Many of the women in custody are repeat offenders. Working with community partners to help them successfully reintegrate back into their communities is key to breaking that cycle and helping reduce capacity pressures at our custody facilities.

As part of our commitment to working with our Indigenous partners, the ministry is proud to continue its relationship with the Saskatoon Tribal Council to bring their expertise, energy, and efforts to support offenders. This partnership is productive, and we enjoy working alongside our partners to help people improve their lives and find success.

The 2025-26 budget continues investments of $1.6 million for STC [Saskatoon Tribal Council] for the delivery of culturally appropriate reintegration and healing supports. This funding includes a program to provide female offenders with safe and successful reintegration services. The program has a strong focus on gendered and culturally responsive approaches to reintegration, and it provides up to 18 months of intensive supports to female offenders who are reincarcerated on minor offences.

This strong partnership with STC includes the sîhtoskâtowin program at Urban Camp for male offenders to support their reintegration efforts. This program was introduced in 2024 and sees correctional workers and the STC jointly creating tailored case plans for men who are leaving custody. The STC helps by providing culturally relevant reintegration services such as access to cultural ceremonies, housing, and income assistance; support to attend court and abide by court conditions; training and education; as well as mental health and addiction referrals.

In 2024-25 we implemented a single addictions recovery support model for all opioid agonist therapy in correctional facilities. This has tripled the number of people accessing this important therapy. In 2025-26 we will continue to invest in this and other addictions programs. We will continue to invest $1.3 million in the delivery of dedicated substance abuse treatment units and 814,000 for the Saskatchewan Health Authority addictions counsellors in adult custody facilities to deliver counselling and programming.

Custody services staff also deliver in-house addictions education programs and arrange for volunteers to run Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous meetings. Further we will continue our work to reduce repeat offending and associated violence by helping gang-affiliated individuals exit gangs through programming and community supports such as our $1.1 million funding partnership with Str8 Up. These programs demonstrate our commitment to giving people the opportunity to start their recovery journey within and beyond the correctional facilities.

In corrections, to ensure that our correctional facilities are safe for offenders, staff, and public, this year’s budget includes $11.7 million to complete and open the Saskatoon Correctional Centre expansion this summer. Once opened, it will add 312 beds for male offenders to help alleviate overcrowding pressures in the system. It will also provide an enhanced ability to manage our inmate population and free up space for programming to help offenders find a better path in life and ensure our infrastructure is maintained to necessary standards.

This year the ministry will also receive funding to begin work on a new 312-bed women’s centre on the grounds of the Regina Correctional Centre. This facility will alleviate the pressures we have been experiencing at Pine Grove Correctional Centre and across the system, but it will do more than this. By having a facility in the south of the province, we’ll be able to keep offenders closer to home and closer to their families. It will also provide more space in the facility to provide programming to help these individuals find a better path in life.

[20:15]

As part of our effort to continue building capacity for the supervision of offenders, we are also investing $1.1 million this year into the electronic monitoring program. This investment will allow us to add the staff and equipment necessary to place an additional 50 offenders released into communities on constant GPS [global positioning system] surveillance. That brings the capacity of electronic monitoring up to 360 offenders. Expanding this program ensures increased public safety through more stringent monitoring of individuals that judges can decide should be managed in the community. It also helps address custody pressures while ensuring public safety.

To ensure a safe and supportive work environment for our front-line staff, the ministry uses recruitment and training initiatives to ensure that we have the workforce in place to help keep Saskatchewan people and communities safe. In 2024 the workforce and planning development team used targeted recruitment strategies that resulted in more than double the number of corrections officers and facility youth workers that were recruited and hired across the province. The ministry is setting these new recruits up for success through effective training to ensure they are confident in their skills.

These focused recruitment strategies have and will continue to prioritize Indigenous candidates, increase female representation, and enhance workplace diversity. The ministry will continue to strengthen its efforts to be an employer of choice in the current labour market.

Under the SPSA, the 2025-26 budget provides the SPSA with a $40.5 million increase for the grant to the agency, including $3.8 million for operating and $36.7 million in capital for the next-generation air tanker fleet. As you may recall, the 2024 response season was extremely busy with 595 wildfires, which is well above the five-year average of 393. Approximately 942,000 hectares burned.

Due to the intensity of the wildfire season, the SPSA requested assistance from seven other provinces and its international partners. However the agency was also able to assist 11 other jurisdictions across North America by supplying personnel and equipment.

Last year the SPSA needed to deploy two separate incident management teams to address five major fires that posed a direct threat to several communities. The agency is busy preparing for the upcoming wildfire season by assessing moisture and runoff conditions, recruiting and training crews, as well as preparing equipment and aircraft. SPSA is also about to launch its annual awareness campaigns to encourage residents and youth to prevent wildfires.

The budget includes a $36.7 million investment in SPSA’s four-year plan to purchase four air tanker aircrafts to enhance our response to wildfire emergencies and assist in evaluation and patient transports.

In conclusion, as highlighted in my comments, the Ministry of Corrections, Policing and Public Safety continues to deliver on policing and community safety services for residents across Saskatchewan. The funding in this fiscal year will ensure Saskatchewan remains safe and secure for all of our citizens to live, work, and raise a family. I’m now pleased to answer any questions about the plan or the budget for the Ministry of Corrections, Policing and Public Safety. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Chair B. McLeod: — Thank you, Minister. I will now open the floor to questions. MLA Sarauer.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you, Mr. Chair. And thank you, Minister, for your opening comments. And I just first want to thank all of the many officials for being here this evening. Greatly appreciate your time as well as your service.

I feel like I always start with policing when we do CPPS [Corrections, Policing and Public Safety], so I’m going to switch things up and start with corrections this time around. Could the ministry provide point-in-time counts for all of the adult facilities?

Scott Harron: — Scott Harron, assistant deputy minister, custody services. You’re looking for point in count. I assume you’re looking for utilization percentages as well.

Nicole Sarauer: — It’s almost like we’ve done this before.

Scott Harron: — Almost as if this happens every year.

Nicole Sarauer: — Yes.

Scott Harron: — And do you want last year’s number at this time as well?

Nicole Sarauer: — I would love percentage change if you have, or whatever’s easiest for you.

Scott Harron: — I can give you the point-in-time count and the utilization for both years, if that helps.

Nicole Sarauer: — Perfect. I’ll do the math. Thank you.

Scott Harron: — Okay. So these are the numbers for April 14th, 2025. I pulled the numbers off this morning. Total adult count today was 2,260 in the adult system. That’s about 104 per cent capacity. Last year at this time it was 2,295, or 108 per cent capacity. I think it’s worth noting this is probably the first year in quite a long time that our custody count is actually down compared to last year by approximately 1.5 per cent. Which, you know, we’re too early in the year to see if that’s going to be a trend but it’s a hopeful sign.

At the Regina Correctional Centre there are 679 inmates, or 87 per cent capacity. Last year at this time there were 780, or 100 per cent capacity.

At the Saskatchewan Hospital North Battleford, 65 inmates, or 68 per cent capacity compared to 46 last year, or 64 per cent capacity. Now that’s because we opened those contingency units, which is why the utilization is a little bit different . . . [inaudible interjection] . . . Which one?

Nicole Sarauer: — Pine Grove contingency?

Scott Harron: — Yes.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay, thanks.

Scott Harron: — There are 20 in the impaired driver treatment program, or 67 per cent capacity compared to 26, or 87 per cent capacity last year.

White Birch, which is a female unit based out of Paul Dojack Youth Centre, has 36, or 106 per cent capacity. Last year there were 16, or 100 per cent. This is because a couple months ago we opened a second unit at White Birch, transferring the women who were in the overflow unit at Prince Albert Youth Residence down to Paul Dojack. It was just a better setup. That also allowed us to move the secure youth back to Prince Albert so they could be closer to their families. So it was kind of win-win.

Whitespruce training facility — that’s the one out in Yorkton — has 30 right now, or 77 per cent. Last year it was 19, or 49 per cent capacity. The team did a really good job this year at making sure that we’re keeping our reduced custody facilities up and running, and in particular out there in the community helping the local area clean up parks or do construction, that sort of thing. Besnard Lake, our other reduced custody facility, is at 18, or 72 per cent. That’s the same as last year.

Saskatoon Correctional Centre is at 599, or 118 per cent as compared to 547, or 108 per cent last year, so it is up. As the minister mentioned, of course we have the new Saskatoon expansion opening up in the summer. We actually have some staff up there right now kind of doing drills, getting prepared for opening, getting to kind of know the building, which will add 312 beds to the system.

Prince Albert Correctional Centre is 587, or 119 per cent right now. That is down from 615 this time last year, or 124 per cent. PACC [Prince Albert Correctional Centre] will be another one of those places we’ll probably likely transfer some people out of when the new expansion opens up, just to give them a little bit of space that we can convert back to programming space. And finally Pine Grove is at 224, or 135 per cent capacity compared to 228, or 137 per cent capacity last year.

Moving on to the youth system, we have 100 youth in custody right now. That’s 72 per cent capacity. We had 109 last year at 78 per cent capacity, so again we’re a little bit down, which is nice to see. Paul Dojack is at 51 youth, 64 per cent capacity compared to 74, or 93 per cent last year. Kilburn Hall is at 35, or 78 per cent capacity compared to 25, or 56 per cent capacity last year. And Prince Albert Youth Residence is at 14, 100 per cent capacity — that’s that opening of that secure wing backup — compared to 10 last year at 71 per cent.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Are you able to provide the percentage of remand versus sentenced offenders per facility as well?

Scott Harron: — I don’t have it per facility on me. I can probably run the numbers while we’re here, but I can give you the full system remand.

Nicole Sarauer: — Global would be great. Yeah, thank you.

Scott Harron: — Pardon?

Nicole Sarauer: — That would be great. Thanks.

Scott Harron: — Sure. Right now today we are at 61.6 per cent remand. This is compared to 60 per cent remand last year at this time. Now the important thing to note is the range over the last three months of remand has been between 58 and 62 per cent, which has held more or less status quo over the last three years. Also important to know, that with the exception of PEI [Prince Edward Island], we are best positioned in Canada when it comes to our remand numbers. The national average is about 73 per cent. On either side: Alberta, at least according to the Stats Canada — this is 2022-23 — data, Alberta is at 79 per cent and Manitoba’s at 75 per cent. Ontario is at 80 per cent. So we’re sitting one of the best in Canada when it comes to our remand numbers. And holding steady over the last couple of years is certainly a good sign.

Nicole Sarauer: — You’ve mentioned that this reduction in numbers, it’s too soon to determine it as an actual trend. I’m talking about the point-in-time counts in particular. But I’m curious to know, when you’re looking at the numbers, if you would describe what’s happening right now as an anomaly or if it’s pointing towards something significant that’s happening in the system.

Scott Harron: — It’s still probably too early to conclude. It’d be speculation at this time. We’ll monitor the numbers over the next year — we monitor it quite closely on a daily, weekly basis — and we’ll see how the trends come out this year before we can draw any conclusions.

Nicole Sarauer: — Do you know if other jurisdictions are experiencing something similar?

Scott Harron: — No, I’m not sure.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay. Now it’s late, but I did catch that the Saskatoon . . . It’s now being rephrased a little bit, what the Saskatoon Correctional Centre expansion is. It used to be called a new remand centre, and it was going to house men and women offenders. Can you explain, is this not simply for remand anymore? Is this going to house sentenced offenders as well as remand inmates?

This is a bit of a change from last year, so just catch me if I’m reading too much into the change in wording here, or if there has been a change in direction for what this new facility will be.

Scott Harron: — So the remand centre was the working name of the centre at the time. It was always the case that this was likely going to be used for both remand and sentenced as the case may be. We don’t want to box ourselves in to one or the other. You know, there’s pressures throughout the system. We want to make sure we’re addressing those types of pressures.

[20:30]

It will also be the front face of the building now. So it will be a brand new spot where people come in, so we didn’t want to kind of box that in. In terms of women, the women’s wing wasn’t part of it as of a couple of years ago. I think we mentioned that at estimates before.

We expect that if it’s necessary there will be a wing in the old SCC [Saskatoon Correctional Centre] building that can be converted to women in order to provide space. But of course as the minister mentioned in his opening speech, we received funding in this budget cycle to begin the design and planning of a new 312-bed women’s facility on the grounds of Regina corrections centre, and that will be the long-term capacity solution for women.

Nicole Sarauer: — When is the projected opening date of the Saskatoon expansion?

Scott Harron: — We will have staff in there likely June 2025 with the first offenders moving in in the summer once we get everything kind of sorted out.

Nicole Sarauer: — How many additional FTEs have been or are being hired for the centre expansion?

Scott Harron: — So the total FTE for the building is 130 staff. Of course it’s a 24-hour facility, so you need a fair number of people to run these things. We received 45 FTEs in the ’24-25 fiscal year, and we received 71 FTEs in this fiscal year. Hard to say how many of those have been hired. We will be hiring those 71s over the course of the year, and I believe all 45 were hired last year. There won’t be 300 offenders that appear overnight, so we will be hiring those kind of as we go over the course of the year.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. And are you targeting for this expansion facility any particular type of offender, or is it more to relieve geographic hot points that you currently have in your facilities?

Scott Harron: — Saskatoon or the new women’s build?

Nicole Sarauer: — Saskatoon. Not Regina yet. I’ll move into that soon.

Scott Harron: — All right.

Nicole Sarauer: — Saskatoon first.

Scott Harron: — So no specific use of it. We don’t want to box ourselves within it. And oftentimes units need to move around based on operational requirements, what the custody population looks like at the time, gang involvement, and that sort of thing. We’ll be looking to empty out some of the contingency spaces that are used so that we can convert them back into programming space.

Nicole Sarauer: — Now the Regina facility project. Can you speak a little bit about timelines for that?

Scott Harron: — So the Saskatoon expansion took about four years. This year for the women’s build there’s going to be the planning and design phase. We won’t know what the timelines are until that process has been completed.

Nicole Sarauer: — Apologies if you’ve already mentioned this. How much money is dedicated for this phase of the Regina project?

Scott Harron: — For this fiscal year?

Nicole Sarauer: — Correct.

Scott Harron: — 7.2 million.

Nicole Sarauer: — Are you already at the stage where you can say where within the current Regina Provincial Correctional Centre footprint the new building will be?

Scott Harron: — Not quite. I think we’ll probably leave that to the designers. We’ve got kind of a notional idea within our head, but of course that’s when the designer comes back and tells us that we’re out to lunch. So I’ll leave that to the professionals.

Nicole Sarauer: — Moving on to Sask Hospital in North Battleford. You had mentioned that there are still some units that are dedicated to Pine Grove inmates. Can you speak a little bit about how many women, Pine Grove women, are currently at Sask Hospital?

Scott Harron: — I’ve got the numbers from March 31st if that works.

Nicole Sarauer: — Sure.

Scott Harron: — So there were nine women in B; that’s the psychiatric unit. There were 20 in both C and D, which are the Pine Grove overflow units.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay, 20. And nine women. I was just about to ask for the non-Pine Grove corrections inmates. So I think you just mentioned nine women on that side. Is that correct? And how many men?

Scott Harron: — 17.

Nicole Sarauer: — 17. What is the percentage utilization for that side?

Scott Harron: — Each one of those is 24 beds. I can do the quick math if you like, but it’s pretty easy calculations.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Are there still any units that are not open?

Scott Harron: — No, they’re all open now.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay. It has been expressed in the past that there have been some challenges in terms of fully operationalizing the corrections side of Sask Hospital North Battleford. I see that it’s still not at capacity and that there are two units being used for Pine Grove inmates. So it seems like it’s still a challenge. What is the challenge at this point in time in fully utilizing that space for corrections?

Hon. Tim McLeod: — So the challenge largely remains consistent with previous years. It’s a lack of psychiatrists in that particular facility. But as you know, we have the most ambitious health human resources action plan in the country, and we’re actively working on recruiting those psychiatrists into the system.

Nicole Sarauer: — Another challenge that had been expressed in years previous, in addition to access to psychiatrists, is the threshold for being qualified to be admitted in, in that you have to be at fairly low risk for violence to be admitted to SHNB [Saskatchewan Hospital North Battleford], at least it was at one point. Is that still one of the requirements to be admitted into the hospital?

Scott Harron: — At the end of day, it’s up to the psychiatrist who gets admitted to the facility. We can and we do refer people who do have violent offences.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Moving away from Sask Hospital and toward the other adult facilities, could you provide for the committee wait times for inmates to be able to access mental health counsellors?

Joshua Freistadt: — Good evening. Dr. Joshua Freistadt, assistant deputy minister, supervision and rehabilitation services. The short answer is, that’s not data we track. The long answer is, there are sort of two predominant ways people get access to mental health care. That is, they may be working with a provider and have insurance, which we’ll arrange through a professional visit. And the other will be referrals to the Saskatchewan Health Authority.

Nicole Sarauer: — So just so I understand, an inmate, to get mental health counselling, will have to seek either outside counselling to come in on their own, through their insurer, or be referred to SHA [Saskatchewan Health Authority] and have that SHA employee come in to provide that counselling?

Joshua Freistadt: — So the answer to your question is yes, basically. Our staff aren’t trained or qualified psychologists, but they are skilled in a number of case management practices. But if you’re looking for formal counselling that is delivered by that sort of profession, then that’s delivered through the Health Authority and not through our staff.

Now our staff are skilled and trained in using trauma-informed case management tools including relapse prevention planning, cognitive behavioural therapy approaches, motivational interviewing, and core correctional practices that really work on building rapport with individuals so that they establish comfort talking about issues and so we can determine if they need that sort of referral. We would also employ registered psychiatric nurses and registered nurses who have specialized education to address mental health, substance abuse, and neurodevelopment disorders.

[20:45]

Staff are trained in ASIST, Applied Suicide Intervention Skills Training, and suicide screening is conducted on intake. For high-complexity cases we have the psychiatric option that we just spoke of through Sask Hospital North Battleford. And when offenders are in the community, they access those same community resources that are available to other folks. Having said that, we do have a contract with a forensic clinical psychology post-doctoral fellow that assists with particularly complicated cases.

On the adult side, for serious violent offenders we have a program called the serious violent offender response, which includes a partnership to help deliver cases with mental health professionals from the Canadian Mental Health Association. So there’s a contract with that association that places a health worker in each area that has that program, and it costs us about $517,000 for that contract.

Nicole Sarauer: — You mentioned registered psychiatric nurses on staff. But just to clarify, those are only operating out of the Sask Hospital North Battleford. Correct?

Joshua Freistadt: — No, we’ll hire registered psychiatric nurses across all of our correctional facilities, as well as RNs [registered nurse].

Nicole Sarauer: — Do you have wait times for accessing registered psychiatric nurses in your facilities that you can provide the committee for any facility other than Sask Hospital?

Joshua Freistadt: — Thank you. There is no wait-list in that those folks are regularly scheduled. So any time during clinic hours, if you’re having an acute issue or when you go to see the medical clinic, you’d have access to the registered psychiatric nurses.

Nicole Sarauer: — What about average wait times for psychiatrists or psychologists?

Joshua Freistadt: — So similar to the previous comments, we don’t have psychiatrists on staff. We rely on the Sask Health Authority. There is a shortage of psychiatrists across the province that the province is working diligently on addressing, so those wait-lists can range upward on the high end to six months. But the important context there is, as we have psychiatrists coming in to do clinic, they’re triaging those cases depending on the acuity of needs.

So some of that wait may be because it’s not seen as a particularly urgent issue with the psychiatrists that we have coming in. We do have psychiatry offered at a minimum of four hours a week at each facility, and again, sometimes that’s dependent on the availability of psychiatrists in the Health Authority.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Has the ministry ever considered hiring mental health counsellors on staff to address some of these needs?

Joshua Freistadt: — Our preference has been to use community providers in order to ensure that there’s continuity of care for those offenders. If we had them on staff, that service ends. And to Scott’s comment before, we’ve got lots of folks in and out of remand on short durations, so connecting them with a community provider is our preferred option.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Moving on to the dedicated substance abuse treatment unit, I don’t — correct me if I’m wrong — I don’t think I heard anything about expanding the program in this fiscal. Can you tell me what the plan is for the units, whether or not they’re going to be expanded this year?

Joshua Freistadt: — So if memory recalls, I think we talked about this a little bit last year too. At that point we indicated, instead of expanding the program, we were going to look to see if we could make some more efficiencies by dealing with the downtime.

Typically that’s a five-week program, and there are two to three weeks between cohorts where we’re trying to see if we can tighten that up. We looked into those two to three weeks after clients move off the unit and found that there’s actually some pretty important work that the SHA-employed addictions counsellors and our own staff do at that time. That includes sort of some closeout paperwork, ensuring there are referrals to the community after someone leaves.

So it’s probably not strictly downtime. It’s more accurate to think of the whole program as probably seven weeks. Nonetheless we encouraged our staff and our contracted partners with the Saskatchewan Health Authority to make things as efficient as possible and ensure that program moves as many people through as possible.

And I’m pleased to say we saw about a 20 per cent increase in the number of people completing that program, and every facility saw more completions. So we had a total of 360 inmates complete that program last year. We will continue to work with the SHA to see if we can further get additional efficiencies out of there. There’s still going to be challenges when you’re cohorting and treating it like a classroom, so we’ll work with our partners to see what continuous intake may look like and if that gets us even further.

Nicole Sarauer: — That’s great news. Can you provide to the committee what the current wait-list is for each unit?

Joshua Freistadt: — So these wait-lists are as of March 1st: at Regina Correctional Centre, 55 inmates; at Pine Grove Correctional Centre, 11 inmates; at Prince Albert Correctional Centre, 28 inmates; and at Saskatoon Correctional Centre, two inmates.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you so much. Could you tell us how many offenders died while in custody in 2024?

Scott Harron: — Scott Harron, assistant deputy minister, custody services. There were four deaths in custody in the ’24-25 fiscal year: April 16th, a male at Regina corrections centre; August 17th, a male at the men’s Saskatoon Reintegration Unit; December 2nd, a male at SCC, Saskatoon Correctional Centre; and March 23rd, a male at the Saskatoon Correctional Centre. There were also two who passed away in hospital after their charges were withdrawn, so they’re not technically deaths in custody, but I want to include them in the list anyway. That’s a female at Pine Grove on April 14th and a male at Prince Albert Correctional Centre on July 4th.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Are you able to provide the committee how many individuals are currently being detained in a correctional facility awaiting deportation or facing detention review?

Scott Harron: — No, we don’t have any. I believe that contract with the federal government ended back in 2023. We’re not essentially in that business anymore.

Nicole Sarauer: — Would they have all been transferred out of province then?

Scott Harron: — That would probably be a question for the federal government.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay. Could you provide the annual cost for the ministry on the contract with Synergy, the inmate phone service?

[21:00]

Scott Harron: — So the Synergy contract, for anybody who doesn’t know, provides telephone services for inmates who are in custody. It also has some specialty features; it’s a very specialized type of program to allow monitoring and that sort of thing, so there’s no criminal activity and whatnot going on.

I don’t have an answer for whether or not it costs us anything. I don’t believe it does, because they earn their income directly from their inmates. I do know, as part of that contract, 10 per cent of Synergy’s profits actually go back into an inmate trust fund so that the inmates are able to use that fund to provide new equipment or whatever they happen to want on the unit.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Are you able to provide any information as to what the cost is to inmates, and whether or not that has been at the same level over the last five years or whether that’s increased or decreased?

Scott Harron: — So the contract was renegotiated back in 2024. There were some changes to the pricing there. Inmates used to receive one free 20-minute local call or free personal call every day. After hearing from the inmates that one 20-minute call wasn’t really conducive to what they wanted to do, we negotiated with Synergy to get two free 10-minute calls, which seems to be working a lot better for the inmates.

The local prepaid 20-minute costs $1.25 for an inmate. I believe that’s about a 50 per cent reduction from the previous contract. And a local collect call for 20 minutes is $1.75. I believe that’s also a 50 per cent decrease from the previous contract. Long distance prepaid 20 minutes per call is $3.25 per 20 minutes. I believe that’s up from what the contract was before. And long distance collect calls, the 20-minute maximum is $5.50 for 20 minutes, which is also a little bit up.

So higher on the long distance but lower on the local calls. There’s also bundle pricing available to make it cheaper for the inmates if they want to do that. So $20 for 15 calls, $35 for 30 calls, or $60 for 60 calls.

Nicole Sarauer: — Is there a fee associated with putting money into an inmate’s account to utilize that service?

Scott Harron: — There’s not a fee that I’m aware of. I know back in August 1st, 2023 they also implemented a new online trust deposit method which makes it easier for family and friends to make deposits on behalf of an inmate rather than of course having to come into the centre each time and use the ATM [automated teller machine]-like machine. So a lot more convenient for people to do it through the online portal.

Nicole Sarauer: — You mentioned that the contract was renegotiated in 2024. How long is this current agreement for?

Scott Harron: — Five years and then a possibility of a five-year extension.

Nicole Sarauer: — Could you table the contract for the committee?

Scott Harron: — We’d have to talk with SaskBuilds before we can make a commitment like that. So we’re not in a position to answer that today.

Nicole Sarauer: — Do you know how much Synergy has made in profit off of the previous contracts?

Scott Harron: — We don’t know the answer to that question. We’re not privy to Synergy’s internal financial information.

Chair B. McLeod: — I’m going to ask that MLA Sarauer move on from that line of questioning as they’re a third-party provider. I don’t think that’s appropriate. Thank you.

Nicole Sarauer: — Minister, you’re well aware of a recent Supreme Court decision, John Howard Society in Saskatchewan, 2025 SCC 6 where some new requirements were placed on the ministry. I’d like to know what the ministry’s plan is for implementing those new requirements pursuant to the decision.

Scott Harron: — Thank you. So the impact of that decision was essentially, under current processes, we’re not able to use disciplinary segregation or loss of remission anymore. In the short term we’ll have to make some changes. We’re in the process of evaluating what the impact of that is and what changes may be required in order to be able to use those methods once again.

In the meantime, we’ve been able to take some things through the minor discipline process, which wasn’t touched by the Supreme Court of Canada decision, as well as use our standard tools to move around inmates to minimize conflicts and that sort of thing. The team’s highly adaptable. It was certainly a switch, but the team’s quite used to being able to pivot on the fly as we need to.

Nicole Sarauer: — There was also, the decision also talks about the role of the decision maker, and there’s a requirement in the decision that the decision maker must be independent and impartial. How will the ministry ensure the independence and impartiality of the decision maker, as is now required?

Scott Harron: — So we know we do need an independent adjudicator now for that sort of thing. We also know we need to hit beyond-a-reasonable-doubt standards as required by the Supreme Court of Canada. How we get there is currently what the team is looking at. It’s still a fairly recent decision. We are moving as quickly as we can.

Nicole Sarauer: — Will this require the drafting of new regulations or will it be in policy? And in any event, what is the timeline for implementation?

Scott Harron: — So the changes required will depend upon the direction that we go. So whether it’s policy changes, regulation changes, is all stuff that our team is currently looking into. The timeline will depend upon similarly which path we decide to take, but in any case we are going to try to get this done as soon as possible. The disciplinary segregation and the loss of earned remission are tools that we do want to have to help control behaviours in the facilities.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you for that. I had other questions in corrections that I wanted to get to, in particular the reintegration work that you’re doing. However I’m cognizant of the time. I’m going to move on to policing. Thank you for answering the questions that I’ve had so far.

And I’m just going to cut to the chase and get to some questions around the marshals. Could you provide some information as to the breakdown in costs to date? In particular I’m thinking assets — vehicles, weapons, uniforms, equipment leased or purchased. We’ll start there.

Robert Cameron: — Good evening. Rob Cameron, chief marshal. So what I can do for you is — I’ve got a list here — I can go through a variety of different items.

Nicole Sarauer: — Great. Thank you.

Robert Cameron: — So we’ll start with vehicles. So total spent since the creation of the organization is 1.398 million. The police equipment is 153,534. These are rounded numbers I’m giving you, by the way. Firearms and ammunition, 934,751; office equipment and furniture, 271,872; contribution to the police college is 205,000; firearms accessories, $52,069; uniforms, 171,264; tools, $13,437; storage facilities, 8,500; office supplies, 59,224; training, 1,800; communications, 68,592; and then salaries . . . Well you’ve asked just about equipment, I guess, at this point.

[21:15]

Nicole Sarauer: — Feel free to give me salaries. I’m going to ask anyways.

Robert Cameron: — Well salaries is 1.776 million rounded.

Nicole Sarauer: — Could you provide a further breakdown in the expenditures on vehicles? And is that all leased or owned?

Robert Cameron: — So the way it works for us is the vehicles are all owned by CVA, so central vehicle agency. They’re in essence leased back to us, and we pay a fee to them. So the cost of what I’ve given you includes equipment and installations that would happen for the vehicles to bring them from, you know, an empty truck to a fully equipped police vehicle.

Nicole Sarauer: — What kind of vehicles are in this 1.398 million that you’ve mentioned?

Robert Cameron: — You’re speaking about make/model kind of vehicles?

Nicole Sarauer: — Trucks? I think you mentioned snowmobiles at one point. Just that kind of level.

Robert Cameron: — Okay, so for our fleet right now we have a variety of SUVs [sport utility vehicle] and trucks as well as we have two snowmobiles.

Nicole Sarauer: — How many SUVs and trucks?

Robert Cameron: — I believe it’s six SUVs and the rest are trucks.

Nicole Sarauer: — How many trucks then?

Robert Cameron: — In total we have 42 police vehicles and six of them would be the SUVs and then the rest are trucks.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay, gotcha. What about IT?

Robert Cameron: — Sorry?

Nicole Sarauer: — IT.

Robert Cameron: — IT?

Nicole Sarauer: — Yeah.

Robert Cameron: — Well we use the Saskatchewan government infrastructure for IT, so that would be the network. We also have a variety of other IT components which are not inside the Government of Saskatchewan. For example, CPIC [Canadian Police Information Centre], the intelligence database system through CISS [Criminal Intelligence Service Saskatchewan], as well as the SGI access to the motor vehicle database.

Nicole Sarauer: — How many FTEs do you currently have hired?

Robert Cameron: — At this point we’ve got 17 officers and then 26 civilian staff at this point.

Nicole Sarauer: — Twenty-six. And correct me if I’m wrong, are those officers currently going through the college?

Robert Cameron: — So 10 of them are at the moment. Those officers are experienced police officers so they’re doing our seven-week training program. And then the others are already in a position and trained.

Nicole Sarauer: — So are they already on the ground?

Robert Cameron: — They include myself as chief, as well as my deputy chief, and superintendents and inspectors that started at the organization first. And so they were already in place. So that was seven of them. And there’s 10 new EPOs [experienced police officer] that are currently going through training.

Nicole Sarauer: — Can you tell me what EPO stands for?

Robert Cameron: — Oh sorry.

Nicole Sarauer: — It’s okay.

Robert Cameron: — Experienced police officer.

Nicole Sarauer: — Oh, okay. So are any of those ones who are not currently going through the college, are they currently working on operations or are they doing front-line work?

Robert Cameron: — The seven, they’re supervisory or management staff. So they’re building the service; they’re coordinating the training; they’re part of the recruitment process for other police officers and various management and functions within the organization.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay, thank you. You have mentioned there is a building in Prince Albert that is currently being leased. Can you provide the cost of that lease?

Robert Cameron: — One second. So the cost for the provincial headquarters building for us which is in Prince Albert is 242,834 and 46 cents.

Nicole Sarauer: — A year?

Robert Cameron: — Annual cost, right.

Nicole Sarauer: — Annual cost. And how long is that lease for?

Robert Cameron: — I beg your pardon, sorry?

Nicole Sarauer: — How long is that lease for?

Robert Cameron: — So the lease is a five-year lease with an option to extend annually.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. I believe it’s been mentioned that there will be a location in North Battleford as well. Can you speak to what the status is of that facility?

Robert Cameron: — So we have announced that we are moving to North Battleford for our first regional headquarters, which is our terminology for, in essence, an operational location that would house a contingent of marshals. At this point in time, we haven’t come to where our actual physical location will be inside of that community, and that’s still a process we’re in right now is to determine that.

Nicole Sarauer: — Do you know how many marshals will be there?

Robert Cameron: — Our initial crew would be around 10. We’re looking towards putting 20 in total in that area.

Nicole Sarauer: — Okay. And with P.A. [Prince Albert] being the only facility you have right now that’s up and running, is that where all of the 17 officers will be located at this time?

Robert Cameron: — So the majority of the officers are in P.A. right at this moment. I’m the only officer that isn’t in P.A. I’m here in Regina.

Nicole Sarauer: — Now I had a question based out of . . . This is the business plan for the Ministry of Corrections, and the budget highlights mentions, at no. 4, that there is $3.6 million to hire 50 positions under the Saskatchewan marshals service. And then right underneath it it says that there’ll be 2.7 million to hire 14 SCAN personnel. I’m just wondering how it only costs $1 million more for 36 more marshals than SCAN officers. I must be missing something here, and I’m wondering if you can explain it to me.

Hon. Tim McLeod: — Thanks for the question. So the 3.6 million for the 50 marshals positions, that’s essentially the salary and expenses that Rob had talked about. The 2.7 million for the SCAN personnel also includes the salaries and the capital and accommodations when that team is deployed wherever they may be. So that’s the budgeted amount for the SCAN personnel, including the capital costs and the accommodations.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you for the clarification. What is the average salary for one of the newly recruited front-line marshals?

Robert Cameron: — So I don’t have it as an average. But what I have is a salary range, and then I can probably provide you that. So it ranges from step 1, which is about 95,000 a year, and then it goes up to a maximum of step 6, which is 117,700 a year.

Nicole Sarauer: — Does that include the wage supplement?

[21:30]

Robert Cameron: — That’s right.

Nicole Sarauer: — Of the 17 officers that you mentioned are hired in this budget, can you provide information as to where those officers’ most recent previous places of employment are?

Robert Cameron: — Of the seven that are currently . . . That’s what you said?

Nicole Sarauer: — Seventeen, I believe you said.

Robert Cameron: — Oh, the 17? I couldn’t do that today. I would have to go back and look at that.

Chair B. McLeod: — I would ask that the relevance of that question back to the budget . . . I’m questioning the relevance of that to the estimates that are before us.

Nicole Sarauer: — I always know when I’m getting to the good stuff, Mr. Chair, so thank you. I will move on. Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Cameron. I really appreciate it. It’s always good to see you, and I appreciate you answering my questions.

I have a question about Highway Patrol officers. Minister, could you provide me with the number of inspections done in the last calendar year?

Corey Zaharuk: — My name is Corey Zaharuk. I’m the assistant deputy minister for policing and community safety services. To give you some context and answer your question, in October 2023 the Saskatchewan Highway Patrol implemented a weigh scale pilot project in Beverley, Saskatchewan, which increased the scale operating time by over 75 per cent. This ensured that we were open 183 days out of the last 283 days of the pilot project.

So I can give you the number of inspections during that pilot period. In those inspections, commercial vehicle safety inspections amounted to 1,471 inspections. The officers issued over 657 tickets at an estimated value of $150,000. CPPS absorbed the cost of the pilot project and the project was concluded in the summer of 2024.

Nicole Sarauer: — Can you give me numbers of vehicle inspections previous to that?

Corey Zaharuk: — This evening I’m just prepared to speak to the estimates. I don’t have that historic data with me.

Nicole Sarauer: — Could you commit to providing to the committee that historic data leading up to the last four years?

Corey Zaharuk: — So to give you some context, Saskatchewan Highway Patrol came under the provincial protective services branch within the Ministry of Corrections, Policing and Public Safety. But prior to that, me making a commitment tonight, I can’t do that because the Saskatchewan Highway Patrol has been under the purview of multiple ministries during the four-year time period that you’re asking for.

Nicole Sarauer: — Can you commit to providing that information since it’s become under the purview of the Ministry of Corrections?

Corey Zaharuk: — I can work to find that answer for you. Some things that are involved here is, I would have to consult with some of my colleagues, extract that information from our records managements system, and we would do the best with it that we could and let you know.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you for that. I appreciate that. Let’s talk about the Saskatchewan Police College. It’s indicated that there are some plans for expanding the work that they do. Can you provide some details?

Brent Penner: — Good evening. My name is Brent Penner, executive director of the Saskatchewan Police Commission. With respect to your question, in this year’s budget there is an additional 1.6 million allocated to the police college. Roughly speaking, that is to be allocated about 50 per cent towards increasing our FTE capacity and the other 50 per cent on operating.

Nicole Sarauer: — Can you provide some further details to what that’s going to look like?

Brent Penner: — Sure. So one of the things we’re trying to do is increase our own instructor complement at the police college. And through that process, we’ll be looking to add another seven FTEs. We’ve already been able to increase that by four, and as the year progresses, we’ll be looking to add another three people.

We’re trying to bring in that instructor expertise into the police college to make us less reliant on borrowing and paying for police officers to instruct from other services, which is expensive. It also reduces the complement of officers that are able to work at their respective police services because they’re at the police college instructing.

Nicole Sarauer: — Is there a current wait time to be able to access a seat at the college?

Brent Penner: — I’m not sure how best to answer that question. Can I ask you to rephrase it?

Nicole Sarauer: — I don’t know how best to ask the question. Maybe let’s start by . . . How about you provide some context as to how forces are able to utilize the police college?

Brent Penner: — Sure. So traditionally the Saskatchewan Police College has had, on the recruit-training side, two recruit classes per year, and that pretty much has gone on for the last 50 years since it opened in 1974. What we are working on right now is a plan to change how that training occurs, such that we’ll be able to increase that capacity and number of recruit-training classes from two, has been the current. Into 2026, looking at either three or four classes, which will increase the number of seats that will be available for municipal and First Nations police services to attend for recruit training.

Nicole Sarauer: — Why was it determined that an increase in seats was needed?

Brent Penner: — Just with respect to the amount of hiring that is going on in policing in our province. Tomorrow morning, for example, I’m at a meeting at the college where we’ll be going through the seat requests for our next intake which will be happening in July. We’ll make determinations on how many seats are allocated to the various police services in the province and be communicating that to them next week.

Traditionally the police college has, I think, done well to adapt to those needs. We’re working on a plan to streamline the number of seats that will be available per class. There’s a couple reasons that we’re looking to do that. One, it will provide more certainty to the police services on the number of seats available. And it’ll also allow us to do a better job in budgeting and forecasting the cost per recruit class with instructor needs as opposed to fluctuating up and down, I guess, as it has been over the years.

Nicole Sarauer: — How often are you unable to accommodate the seat requests made by varying forces?

Brent Penner: — Yeah, to my knowledge — and I’ve only been in the position less than a year — it happened during COVID or a few years back where Saskatoon and Regina made determinations to send a small number of recruits to be trained at Depot. I think that number is under six in total. And I guess tomorrow we will be starting to pare through those numbers. And we’re also, I guess, looking at not only what training seats will be allocated for the rest of this year but then working that into the plan for 2026.

Nicole Sarauer: — Great, thank you. Minister, could you provide some further information as to the additional funding for the electronic monitoring program?

[21:45]

Joshua Freistadt: — I thought I was done. No, it’s all good. Thank you. So as the minister mentioned in his opening remarks, this budget sees $1.1 million go towards salaries. Lease of the equipment, we’re required to do GPS tracking; that includes all the units, the ankle bracelets, etc. It allows us to put 50 additional people under this form of monitoring. Who gets put on it is determined by the courts. It tends to be people on bail and that the courts are deeming on the lower-risk end of the spectrum.

The additional being the total electronic monitoring use of 360; and of the 1.1 million, 669,000 is for salaries; 329 is for operating — that’s the lease agreement; and 85,000 is for accommodations and IT.

Nicole Sarauer: — You mentioned that there are 360. Is that available across the entirety of the province, or is it just specific geographic locations?

Joshua Freistadt: — The entire inventory is available across the province and distributed on a sort of first come, first served basis based on the court orders.

Nicole Sarauer: — And how much is this budget expanding that number?

Joshua Freistadt: — So previously there were 310 units, not all of which were GPS units; 190 of those were what we call RF [radio frequency] units. They’re basically just bracelets that tell you if you’re at home or not. Kind of more like Bluetooth technology. And then there was 120 GPS units added in ’23-24, and this then brings the additional amount up another 50 for the GPS only.

Nicole Sarauer: — And you mentioned this equipment is leased. Who is the third party that this contract is with?

Joshua Freistadt: — So we lease this through a Canadian company called Jemtec. They have a subcontract with a company headquartered out of Tel Aviv, Israel, and we’ve confirmed that like none of the components are manufactured in the United States.

Nicole Sarauer: — What is the name of the company in Israel?

Joshua Freistadt: — Allied Universal.

Nicole Sarauer: — And how long is the contract for?

Joshua Freistadt: — I don’t have that information in front of me right now. I know that it does not expire in the calendar year at which we intend to do this expansion. I’d have to check in with SaskBuilds and Procurement.

Nicole Sarauer: — That would be great. And if possible if you could table that contract, that would be appreciated as well.

Joshua Freistadt: — Our response there would be the same as your previous request to table a contract. I mean I don’t know if I can commit to that. I’d have to check in with SaskBuilds and Procurement.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you. Hopefully you are done now.

Joshua Freistadt: — No, happy to stay.

Nicole Sarauer: — I do want to ask about the P.A. Grand Council feasibility study for self-administered policing that you had mentioned. Minister, could you provide some further information about that?

Matthew Mirasty: — Good evening, committee. It’s a pleasure to be here this evening to speak to, related to, the Prince Albert Grand Council feasibility study for self-administered policing. tânisi, my name is Matthew Mirasty. I’m the executive director of First Nations Indigenous policing for the ministry, and I’m based out of Prince Albert where the feasibility study is also headquartered.

In the wake of the James Smith tragedy in the fall of 2022, there was a universal call by PAGC [Prince Albert Grand Council] Nations, to which James Smith is a member Nation, to do a serious exploration of self-administered policing in the territories of Prince Albert Grand Council and look at new ways of addressing the public safety needs of these Nations and the communities that are part of them.

We partnered with PAGC, the ministry, Public Safety Canada and began some arduous work to get to a place where we could officially begin the feasibility study in the end of the ’23-24 fiscal year. That work is continuing in this budget here. We are in our last year of a two-fiscal-year project specifically aimed at the feasibility of this project. There’s been significant work done by officials hired by PAGC for this work and by PAGC employees, as well as myself and members of my team and colleagues from different branches within the ministry. The RCMP have had a significant role in this work and the partnerships that have expanded and grown and the understanding related to public safety needs for PAGC communities has been extensive.

In the first year of this feasibility study, officials from PAGC went out to communities and did significant community engagement, in a manner going to communities, sitting with Elders. Having town halls if you will; band halls, somebody said to me recently. But meetings and discussions related to the project and the work being done, and I guess identify issues as related to how do we get to a place where we can make an informed decision related to our public safety needs as it relates to self-administered policing development.

Within that, these engagements are happening, and actually I’d say are also evolving as the project is under way. It’s not just a one-and-done visit to a community like Hall Lake, Lac La Ronge Indian Band member community. It may actually be several visits to the community.

I’m paraphrasing here, you know. When we get into the communities and PAGC does speak to members of the Nations, the questioning really is about, you know, the basic needs related to policing before getting into more specific issues that people may want to bring up as it relates to their policing. And of course, you know, what would the future look like, and how can we get there collectively?

It’s in a manner, you know . . . What’s going well? What’s not? What can be better? This is what we’re proposing. This is the work involved. How does your community feel about public safety? Are you engaged in the current services that you’re getting? And how can we work together, in one regard not only from the self-administered development but also in the day-to-day current reality and the relationships that exist with our various enforcement services in Saskatchewan, and of course primarily the RCMP as the police of jurisdiction in Saskatchewan.

This year there’s going to be a lot of work, I guess, compiling the data as it relates to the project, sitting down again with member Nations collectively, the province, the federal government after the federal election and having more thorough discussions around some of the data elements and research elements that have been under way in this past year. Various branches in our ministry are involved in that work, as well as the RCMP as I’ve mentioned before, and in some manner the Saskatchewan Police Commission and other related partners.

We’re getting to a place that I hope where the member Nations of PAGC by March of 2026 are going to be in a position with the report to take time, to go back to their Nations, and over the summer of ’26, get to a place where they can make that informed decision about the future of their Nations and communities and also how we can fit in into that reality.

And by the end of the fall of ’26, again it’s really about the completion of the report. PAGC will have an annual assembly, and that work will be talked about, and then the delegates will make a decision whether or not to proceed and move forward with the province and the federal government in I guess self-administered development.

Nicole Sarauer: — Thank you for that fascinating work going on in this space.

Matthew Mirasty: — It is fascinating. Yeah, it is. It’s amazing actually.

Nicole Sarauer: — It is. I’m curious to know, in the consultation that’s happened so far . . . I understand you haven’t completed the report, but are there themes that are emerging? What’s striking you as interesting in the feedback you’re receiving from the community?

Matthew Mirasty: — Well I think the most interesting insight for me is, you know, I’m from Saskatchewan. I’m a proud member of the Lac La Ronge Indian Band. I’m a third-generation RCMP officer, retired, and I’ve been working with the ministry for six years. And the conversations I’m having through this work, through this lens, is opening in a whole other realm for me as far as really showing that communities have such a strong understanding of public safety and justice in their communities and really looking for a place to have a better discussion.

And I believe this project has facilitated that with PAGC, but also it’s informing other tribal councils and other large First Nations in Saskatchewan who are looking at the exploration of self-administered policing and giving a lot of people pause to, you know, look and say, okay, we’re seeing what our partners at PAGC are doing; we’re seeing the headway that they’re getting. They’re also seeing the difficulties and complexities related to public safety in their communities, and they’re having good conversations about it.

And for me that’s the big takeaway: a large, significant endorsement of the RCMP as our provincial police service. But at the same time, they’re able to look for and go, okay, how does that partnership change? And how can we work together with the redcoats, so to speak, and get to a place where we can take over the baton of public safety in our communities and our Nations and continue that work together in the future?

Another big part of it is the interest in the First Nation community safety officer program and other civilian-related roles in public safety that might enhance, you know, their community safety and justice-related initiatives.

Nicole Sarauer: — I know after the tragedy at James Smith the Nation did create a — and I’m forgetting the name; what it’s called? — civilian-led community response officers. How is that work going within James Smith right now?

Matthew Mirasty: — So the community safety officer program, I think, is what you’re referring to. James Smith, we’ve been doing a lot of work with them lately. Actually we have a meeting, might be tomorrow. But we’ve been working on a number of areas as it relates to their relationship with the RCMP. Improving the relationship was a big thing for them, getting a better understanding of their public safety.

Obviously there were initiatives related to some of their local security that were very important to them, and feeling safe and secure, you know. With the scale of the tragedy at James Smith, you know, we can only all really be observers to that — unless we’re from that community — to understand what they went through.

And currently we are engaged with consultants from James Smith and looking at CSO [community safety officer] program and working with them through the summer to see how it fits their needs. Without speaking on their behalf, they’re doing a number of initiatives related to public safety and health that they do also prioritize. And so we are looking forward to doing more work with James Smith in particular.

[22:00]

And also with their inclusion within the PAGC project they’ve gained valuable insights as well as to the future of their specific needs for public safety. So it’s the work collectively at the PAGC level, but also the work we’re doing with them and the federal government. And some of their consultants will also, I’m sure, benefit the Nation in the future.

Chair B. McLeod: — We’ve reached the end of our question time, and it’s been . . .

Matthew Mirasty: — I was just getting started.

Chair B. McLeod: — It’s actually been very, very fascinating to hear this conversation, and I thank you so much for that information that we’ve received. And we wish you all the best in the endeavours down the road.

Matthew Mirasty: — Thank you very much.

Chair B. McLeod: — Minister, I’m going to ask if you have any closing comments for this evening.

Hon. Tim McLeod: — Thank you, Mr. Chair. I do. I want to thank the committee for their attentiveness, and Ms. Sarauer for her very detailed and thorough questions. And I hope that the committee is able to appreciate, given the context of all the great work of these great officials, who I can’t thank enough for the support that they provide both myself, and the people of Saskatchewan more broadly, each and every day.

But the work that they’re doing and the investments that are being made in that work really do flow across the entire continuum that I hope the committee was able to see tonight, where on one end, you’ve got the policing and the investments that we’re making in more SCAN officers and more municipal officers, more marshals, investments in the police college, freeing up police from other duties, allowing them to be more front-line.

And also the legislative and the regulatory changes that we’re making to try and give our officers more tools to use. The safe public spaces legislation, the SCAN legislation, the trespass to property legislation: all of those changes working at that front end of the entire continuum, which of course is going to lead to the middle part of the continuum that we started the evening with, in Justice, and the investments that then will need to be made there — expanding the traffic courts, municipal bylaw hubs, more prosecutors, additional supports for case readiness.

On the firearms side, the new ballistics lab that unfortunately we didn’t get to talk about tonight; we ran out of time. And then moving further into the corrections, which we did have an opportunity to spend quite a bit of time on, but the investments in the new Saskatoon Correctional Centre expansion, the electronic monitoring that we discussed, and certainly the excitement around the new 312-bed unit for women in Regina.

All of those, when you invest in one piece of that, you have to invest in all. And I hope that the committee was able to see the great work that these teams are doing each and every day to make sure that the entire continuum stays in balance. And we’re providing great service to the people of Saskatchewan through both of these ministries that the committee saw tonight.

So again, my thanks to the committee. My sincere thanks to all of the officials who joined. I’m sorry if some of you didn’t get a chance to come to the microphone, but we do appreciate you nonetheless. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And thanks to Madam Clerk and to Hansard for sticking it out throughout the entire evening. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Chair B. McLeod: — Thank you, Minister McLeod. Opposition MLA Sarauer, you’ve any comments to close for this evening?

Nicole Sarauer: — Yeah, of course. I’d like to first thank the minister for answering the questions that I had this evening and echo the sentiment that you’ve already spoken so well about. The continuum of the justice system was laid out bare, I think, for all of us this evening. And I, like you, am filled with so much gratitude for the work that your officials do all the time, not just in preparation and in sitting for this evening, but in every single day in keeping our communities safe.

I have so many questions that I didn’t get the chance to get to, so my deepest apologies for those who weren’t able to come and speak about the work that you do. Please know that I’m genuinely very interested in every aspect of this ministry, and all of it is so incredibly important.

So just thank you so much for being here this evening and spending your late evening with us and for answering all of my questions. I am very, very grateful to all of you.

Chair B. McLeod: — Thank you so much everyone that’s been involved tonight. It’s been really a joy to be the Chair tonight. Committee members on both sides, you’ve just been very, very good to work with, so I appreciate that so much.

The last conversation around electronic monitoring I couldn’t help but think I’ve got 350 dairy cows at home have much the same technology attached to their legs, or to their necks I should say. And I know it’s an Israeli company that provides that as well, so maybe even the same one. And it’s not because they have a court order to be kept in line, but it provides a great management tool for us as well.

So thank you so much. We’ve got some lucky officials in the crowd that get to go home. Committee members, we do need to stay, and we have some conclusion that needs to happen. But thank you very much for the officials, and we’ll allow you to be dismissed. And don’t go anywhere, committee members please; we have to finish with the resolutions.

Right. We’re going to vote off now on 2025-26 estimates. Vote 73, Corrections, Policing and Public Safety. Central management and services, subvote (CP01) in the amount of 57,653,000, is that agreed?

Some Hon. Members: — Agreed.

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